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Signs of The Times - May 2011


Erik Sine

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PART 1

Nothing much to report form other magazines this month, and after returning from ISA Expo in Las Vegas just today, I had the new May issue layed out for me right on top of the dining room table.

It tells of the Community Organizer's new hire of an editor, and an email article he received from a Robert Laurencelle of Shiner Signs in New England. He first describes it is being very "generic" with not enough interest. He probably should have listened to his initial instincts rather than write an article about them in "From Turn of the Centruy to Cellular", at least when it came to his energy figures, he should have used his omitting/delete button to save the article. He probably should have listened to the lighting consultant too, and published his comments instead of omitting them.

That's alright, we'll tell it like it is here for Robert Laurencelle of Shiner Signs. I thought for sure we would never hear claims even high than the "Magic Mouth" out of Jacksonville who said 60% to 80%. But, here it is, and in print, now it's bumped up to 90%.

"Neon is fading into the background do to damage and energy savings other light sources offer. Replacing neon lighting with LEDs = energy saving of 75% to 90%, with less maintenance and longer life, While eliminating mercury content"

Same ol song and dance. The Community Organizer still continues to fall into the pit and that levee is not getting any stronger.

The Community Organizer needs to ask specifics of Mr. Laurencelle of Shiner Signs. What is Mr. Laurencelle talking here red, or colored? What LEDs is Mr. Laurencelle using? Is anything of his choice LEDs produced in China where coal plants are being used? if so, that is mercury vapor being throw into the atmosphere to produce these LEDs. Not so Green is it?

Does Mr. Laurencelle take any light readings of his choice LEDs in comparing them to LEDs? I don't suppose he's using a low grade low light emmiting LED that doesn't not put out near enough light as a neon lamp and saying he's saving energy as high as he is is he? Is he comparing 60ma neon, liek all unlikely comparison go across out great planet?

Longer Life than neon? Really? Prove it, after all they are 106 years old right, right?. Red neon does not degrade in light as does an LED over time, in most cases when processed right we know that's a lamps life of at least 20 years. I did not know the Sloan V-series red has been around that long to make such a statement. Sure, Red LEDs are a lot more energy efficient than red neon, but let's not mix in "longer Life", there is something we all agree on, that's "Checks and Balances". In White, comparable light output needs to be addressed (Once again). High output whites are not as efficient as lower class LEDs, and they need more energy. We don't want to compare TetraMAX mini's to a Tri-Phosphor lamp and say it's 80% energy efficient, that is comparing a pen flashlight to maglite

ROI ROI ROI, real numbers for the sign user please, INSERT HERE

The problem with a lot of these National Companies, they produce on convenience and bottom line rather than "Quality", sure it sometimes makes sense to worry about breakage coming from lamps, but how much other breakage and loss comes from the workplace on a monthly basis on everything from vehicles, machinery and tools.

Why do I feel like I'm almost repeating myself month after month? Does the Community Organizer not want the angry "letters to the editor" to stop? Now he's getting off to a VERY bad start with teachings to his new young sith apprentice.

Most of the Quality LED manufacturers that I know, who have integrity don't even advertise or sell on "Energy Efficiency", or with the "Mercury" scare, because even they know it's a farce.

This is May's issue, of an email he just received from January. Maybe the Community Organizer should dig into his waste basket, errrrr, omit basket of articles sent to him nearly over half a year ago and finally dig into one that show/demonstrate factual numbers....oh I don't know, maybe there is one in there all twisted up into a paper ball there, written about the CITGO retrofit, now re-retrofit, maybe by someone close to the project who can demonstrate REAL facts & FIGURES. Well, the "Organizer" may not want to offend one of his biggest advertisers with that one, so let's just keep that in the trash basket.

Other that this, it's another rabbit being pulled out of a hat, with a hint of hesitation to publish in the first place.

PART 2 - ISA Rising

Now ISA wants to expand their "Supplier/Distributor" conference membership, and add a ISA program, more programs. More inner industry regulation, more ISA money. Are you ready for this next part now?

They want to add National Sign Companies into the mix, and to find a way to regulate subcontractors and find better ways for them to install. So is the general idea to develop and package a pre-approval process for subs, to bring in more money?

The pun? It's coming.....wait for it, wait for it. Here it is, what is ISA going to do about a large portion of National Sign Companies that can't even pay their subs on time? National Sign companies that owe Suppliers and Distributors large amounts or cash? These are very large past due, past net term invoices? This will be a curious conference filled with evil glares and fake greeting hand shakes

What ISA needs to do instead of finding away to develop a pre-approval method for subs and get a way to get them to be "Qualified" and "Professional" to be a part of "their" team, is figure a way for these National Sign companies to quit abusing subcontractors as their "line of credit", and paying them on time, on terms according to a contract. In most states, terms of a contract are 30 days. ISA needs to develop a program for these National Sign Companies instead. But since NSC hold have the money, I doubt this will happen, how many NSC's would show up for this conference. ISA also needs to figure out a way of helping to eliminate illegal subcontracting by NSC's who hold no licenses in various states acting as a primary contractor and illegally subcontracting to sign companies.

The dirty little secret that non one like to talk about E.g. A NSC in New York who holds no license in CA, executing a contract with a client in CA then subbing a sign company in CA to install it. Illegal? YOU BETCHA!!!!

Let's work on the little things first, instead of finding ways to have NSC's make their subs go through National Sign Company UNION, EEERRRR, ISA programs. After all, in the ISA report it is mentioned that we are in a bad economy, let's pay our bills first. ISA should be putting membership warnings to various NSC's who are outstanding, and not living up to the code of ethics. It appears collecting membership dues is on the higher priority list.

Curious thing, why is it the Sign Syndicate has a National Sign Company Review directory for work relationships and payment terms with subs and ISA does not?

GREEN GREEN GREEN, the new communist red.

I Know Theresa young likes to hug signs and trees, but let's hope for out own personal liberties in this country that the new red movement is not a trend, but a migration. Let's find a way to FIGHT a "environmental product & safety" movement rather than try to brainwash, ooopps excuse me, assimilate everyone into. I know in order to make a stronger Marketing statement and blurt out hype these days we must use Fear & Guilt, but let's try and aid an association in fighting a movement that robs this nation and it's industry of individual liberties, and educate our clients the misnomers of the Green. Even upon asked, it should still be given two sides.

Why ISA is going down the dark path of Green, it goes beyond me. It speaks of a bad economy, but yet it pushes for the red movement, guised under the color green.

This is why I wonder why so many in these association positions are retreads, regurgitated individuals that get recycled in time after time. Like I said in the past, who like rhino politicians, there's hardly any good ones.

What needs to happen is or the Good Association executives and directors to speak out, the ones that still have some integrity. But with the induction of more red, I mean green members like Magic Mouth who sell on fiction, it has to be a hard place in this association these days.

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill

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Guest Signtiffic

A NSC in New York who holds no license in CA, executing a contract with a client in CA then subbing a sign company in CA to install it. Illegal? YOU BETCHA!!!!

Still reading through this post and digesting it. .... However, this sentence caught my eye. What are you basing this on?

My understanding is that the uniform commercial code allows for this and there is no CA state law which prevents this... THAT IS predicated the sub-contractor in california meets the licensing requirements of the state. If it is indeed illegal ....shit... thats a punch in the gut to every American Business's freedom. This is the US of A afterall.

Next you're going to tell me I need a freaking Visa to travel state to state on holiday or what ever. That's riddiculous

Again, still digesting the rest of this.... the above sentence is the only thing I don't agree with. EDIT: Added.... so far that is

Edited by Signtiffic
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Hate to beat the dead horse on this one, and I'm not really picking on it as a major issue other than maybe ISA should spend more time with it instead of worrying about trying to possibly profit farming from inventing a program to get subs "qualified" whereas they should put a priority on getting the subs paid on time instead which is a bigger issue in our industry.

Back to the question yes, it is illegal. Only a Contractor with a license (in the state where work is performed) can subcontract, this is the same in a lot of states such as Texas, NV, AZ, WA and others. Some of these large nationals hold license's across many states other than their own, some do not. Nor do National Service companies. It's a loophole no one wants to deal with, nor pay attention to. But, when it comes to National Service companies it makes me wonder if the law was enforced, would it benefit our industry any? In reality the only way to get around it is to have the sub sign a contract directly with the sign user, instead of being an actual sub. This assures consumer an contractor protections in our state.

Like I've said before in the past, I'n NOT going to get a lot of people talking about this issue because everyone wants to make money, and a lot of people stand to lose money if was ever on the top of an agenda

But the bigger issue right now is ISA's hand going into the cookie jar of rounding up all the Nationals to develop programs to get the subs to pony up to be "verifiable" subs

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill

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Guest Signtiffic

I seriously doubt that you're correct about it being illegal. Seriously seriously doubt it. More importantly I agree 110% with not discussing it in this thread.... but it should be discussed.

Of course the the rest of your intial post has got me a little steamy.... on your side with that. More to come.... still bashing thoughts around in my head about it.

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Don't take my word for it, look up the CA state contractors license law here in CA. The CSA past president even touched on it lightly here in another thread in regards to illegal contractors. The thread about illegal subcontracting when it came to unlicensed franchise shops like Sign A Rama & Fast Signs. This is one of the key points I remember when i took my contractors exam

The same rule applies, if you're not licensed in this state you cannot perform any work, even if you subcontract to licensed company. But I don't really want to open that can of worms here in this topic.

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill

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  • Board Patron

I don't have this months issue, is this really where ISA wants to steer the ship to? >>>>

Edited by TecnoluxMan
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  • 3 weeks later...
  • !llumenati

Wait till they have Holographic signs, No installers, no fabricators. Property management companies will be King, You no pay rent, Poof sign out.

I think they are steering which ever way the money trail goes. Heading through the fog, Hey Captain, which way we going?.....Uhhh make up a direction, they'll follow anyway.

GOOD things happen for a reason......

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Wait till they have Holographic signs, No installers, no fabricators. Property management companies will be King, You no pay rent, Poof sign out.

Crazy stuff in the scope for sure, they'll be talking to us very soon...

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