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Erik Sine

The Great White Hope Light Test and Others

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Sorry everyone for the further delay on getting the Great White Hope back up in the running. It was supposed to be up in Aug, then Sept, then Oct.

It became even harder once the Christmas Season got closer but the good news is it WILL be even better than the first because the Neon will have a broader variety than before. We will have FMS Neon, EGL, Voltarc, maybe Tecnolux but one vendor I'm looking forward too is one from across the great pond...."Glostertube"

It's taking longer but I think the wait will be worth it at the end.

Remember when we first started this test it was more about how LED's compare to Neon, now we'll concentrate more on the individual comparison of what each product can give you according to your application. Sadly we ended at 36k hours but this will be our new 100,000 hour test and beyond for high powered whites.


You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill

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  • Similar Content

    • By Erik Sine
      Originally Posted Mar 15 2014 05:43 PM

      The Great White Hope II - (Year 1 & 2)

      February 2014 - Present




      The only thing we ask is, if you like what you see and if it helps you make better buying decisions for your sign applications that you build then you can support us and the tests we do by either upgrading your free membership to a Board Patron which has it's additional benefits or by purchasing electrical sign supplies that we sell here on The Sign Syndicate as you'll see in the test result sheets!


      One thing that we don't sell here on The Sign Syndicate for the exact reasons of these tests is sell Neon Glass or LED Modules because I know most would think us bias if we did. So because of this, we'll only sell electrical sign supplies that compliment these light sources such as LED power supplies, and neon wiring & Transformers etc.

      You'll also notice a lot of Light Source MFG's signed up here on the Sign Syndicate and submitted their lamps for the testing. Some did not, and you'll see "Non-Willing Participant" next to their name in the Tutorial product listings. Most did not want to because they did not want to be compared to their competition or called out on their claims when they show up to your shop and tell you you should buy theirs because they are superior to their competition. Well, all we can do here is include some of those MFG's anyway and throw them up on the board and see where they might fall. We hope some of them at some point join us and take part because they want to. They ALL have an open invitation to do so. We thinks it's a good idea and there is a lot to learn and most of the time it just begs more questions than results can answer. If you are a Light source manufacturer interested in having your lamps included then please upgrade your free membership to a Board Vendor (which includes a free advertising package for the duration of your membership) and submit your lamps


      I first to want to start off by thanking everyone who has been involved with this project from the start and continue to make it better, I want to specially thank Telford Dorr for this immeasurable measurements, Marko of YYZ LED Systems for helping to move this project in a better direction and the Vendors who have participated with their products for this comparison.


      Though 6500 SW is the standard here for comparison you'll see a variation of whites, not all are of course in the same ballpark, but you will see where pending the application you might choose one over the other.


      You might see some edits done on this tutorial over the course an that is because information may/will change.


      Every month power readings and light output readings will be added to this tutorial. Other tests may also be done not yet defined at this point. A picture will also be taken with the same settings and placement.


      THE TEST:

      First, The Great White Hope II is for high powered LEDs 1watt + and above, all others below are for Project Tighty Whitey. This is also for Neon & Tri-Phosphor Neon Lamps.

      Like our other tests, we are taking period reads and measuring the light output of every single light source in our test right on the sign face which is made up of a 8" x 8" marked square on the same spot every time and we average the highs and lows.

      For the initial power consumption measuring for the LEDs we are using a GW Instek programmable power supply. This PS measure and tells us what each string pulls as if the power supply they were on is running at 100% efficiency. Why we do it this way is because the power supply YOU use for your applications will vary and we want to level the plain field.

      On the Neon side of things we are just going to use the age old France Footage/Watt Chart, this is also to assume the neon is running on a typical magnetic power supply. We are also not including the 1 extra foot of power consumption per pair of electrodes per lamp because this would greatly skew the numbers of small 2' light sources.

      The main thing about this benchmark test is that we are looking at lumen maintenance and how much each product will hold up over time and monitor the light degradation. One thing I wish we could measure and monitor is the color shift over time of each product. Maybe we will get access to a spectrometer in the future because there is a huge shift of some products over time and we will notice in our yearly shots that we take for comparison.



      SIGN CHANNEL STRUCTURE

      Well, instead of the large sectioned out cabinet we had for the first Great White Hope this time we did assimilated to our other tests and fabricated individual channels for each light source.


      LIGHT SOURCE PRODUCT LIST (Top to Bottom)
      Axiom LED AXLE9XB 13mm EGL DL 61 ((Tri-Phosphor 60ma) *-Non-Willing Participant 15mm Voltarc 6500 SW *-Non-Willing Participant 13mm Voltarc 6500 SW *-Non-Willing Participant 15mm FMS TC 6500 (Tri-Phosphor) 15mm Glostertube 6500 6500 166 (Tri-Phosphor) 13mm EGL DL61 (Tri-Phosphor) 13mm Voltarc Tri-Lite *-Non-Willing Participant 12mm FMS TC6500 (Tri-Phosphor) Permlight El Plato HO *-Non-Willing Participant GOQ LED *-Non-Willing Participant GE Tetra Power Max *-Non-Willing Participant International Light Technologies Summit Sloan GW4 *-Non-Willing Participant Permlight Twister *-Non-Willing Participant Hyco CooChip SIGN COMPONENTS
      1/8" Cyro #7328 White Acrylic Lens Faces CCFL Transformers- Ventex 6030/60CL CCFL Transformers- Ventex 6030/30CL Axiom 60 Watt Class II LED Power Supplies Transco TC200 Porcelain Housings FMS Neon Tube Supports Plasco Trim Cap

      DURATION:

      This project is never stopping, it runs for two 10 hour cycles a day 365 days a year


      NEON & LED POWER:

      Unlike the first Great White Hope where we had dedicated power sources for each lamp are are copying our other light test projects that consist of all light sources on a shared power supply. For the LEDs are are using the surplus military grade Axiom LED Power Supplies left over from the GWH (So to continue their endurance at 40k+ operating hours) because of the manual DC voltage set screw to assure we have exactly 12volts across all LED strings to level the playing field. For all Neon Lamps we are using our surplus SST Ventex Neon Transformers to again, continue to monitor their endurance as well at 40k+ hours of operation. All Neon lamps are on a shared SST.




      EARLY TEST PICTURES

      Finally lighting up all the neon side of the project



      The same for the LED side



      The back side of the project







      March 15, 2014

      Today is the first evaluation since the project has been ongoing. The only thing we have in news is that as usual all the Neon lamps are taking their initial lumen maintenance that comes in the first 1000 or so hours then we'll see them plane off gradually.

      Below are the pics of the class of 2014.

      I'm just going to show off one pic of the Neon, because no one will be able to distinguish one from the other.

      PIC1



      Hyco CooChip



      Permlight's El Plato HO



      GE's Tetra Power Max



      GOQ's Quad Chip LED



      Sloan's GW4



      International Light Technologies Summit



      Permlight's Twister



      I'm currently looking to add US LED's Quasar 3, Osram, and Agilight and whatever other LED manufacturers decide to join us in this ongoing comparison project.

      In a short observation we're already seen a 16% drop in light output from the CooChip and we'll see what happens next period.

      Just this month a national sign company gave us a few strings of AgiLight LEDs that they wanted to see in our various tests that they also use for a national sign program. The string that we will be putting up for GWH II will be the Apex series, this will be for April.

      Some of the LEDs we have in our tests come from sign companies who are curious about the performance of products they use, and when doing so it helps us all out and we all learn.


      MARCH 2014 EVALUATION DOWNLOAD


      SEPTEMBER 2014 EVALUATION
      10/30/14

      It's been some time. In August we added Axiom LEDs AXLE9XB module at 14.7 volts on a dedicated power supply, the LEDs come in at 1.6 watts each.

      AXLE9XB



      We're a little over a month of reporting these late September results and about two weeks short of doing Novembers. It's been some time so I may add or make changes to the above information.

      The download sheet for September can be found here

      Link http://www.thesignsy...arison-results/
    • By Erik Sine
      I'm sending a notice to all that I'm going to be trimming down on our testing and purging a lot of LED products that are either out dated or the manufacturers are no longer vendors here.
      Currently we have just too many and a lot are out dated and some of those companies have downsized or pretty much non-existent, or I just no no desire to pursue them since their either not widely used or advertised as much as they used to be.
      I'm going to keep the mainstream guys because well, that's who a lot liek to watch and observe to see if their products last as long as they claim in the full sized magazine page ads say it does, like GE, USLED, Agilight, Sloan, and probably Sylvania / Osram. All others unless their vendors from this site I'll be tossing those out, I may keep some smaller vendors around but I'll pay that by ear.
      Anyone know if Permlight is still around? Haven't seen them at a show for awhile now and not sure if they even advertise in magazine anymore.
      So, if you're not one of the named above, shoot me over a message if you still want to stay on board, otherwise the "Purge" is coming to make room for others in the following tests
      The Great White Hope II
      Project Tighty Whitey
      The Red Light District
      Blue Light Special
      Nothing will be changing for Border Security, maybe just drop one or two.
      Thanks!
    • By Erik Sine
      July 2014 Electric Sign Industry Neon & LED Test Comparison Results



      Below are the various categories of our test results made available for the electric sign industry. You can download the newest Sign Syndicate test comparison .pdf result sheet at the bottom of every Light Project Test entry with the most current date.

      Please remember....we have now made these light testing results available to you for free. If you feel like you have learned/gained something from these results or found that these results have saved you money by choosing one product over another please help support us in upgrading your free membership, or by purchasing various sign supplies we have available for you & your company. Many of our sign supply products are usually well below what you might pay for at one of the mainstream sign suppliers and some are bundles with free shipping. We've attached many various banners to the results in hope something may grab your eye.

      The Sign Syndicate does not engage in light source lamp sales such as LED's or Lamps so that we do not become a biased source for news & information and maintain that high standard of only dealing with the facts.

      For individual test result updates & information visit the Project Tutorials located here LINK

      As always, enjoy the results and hope you learn as we do going down this adventurous path!



      The Great White Hope II (Year 1) - The high powered white Neon & LED test comparison for large channel letters and sign cabinets, comprised of high powered LED modules 1watt+ and above with Tri-Phosphor Neon Lamps. (2,300+ hrs)
      Later this month we will add NC LED New high powered module as well as two of Axiom LED's products
      GreatWhiteHopeII 071514.pdf


      Project Tight Whitey (Year 3 & 4) - The white exclusive LED only test comparison for mid (.85 watt modules and below) to mini sized LED modules. (34,000+ hrs)
      This month we introduce new module as well as NC LED,
      ProJectTight 071515.pdf


      The Red Light District (Year 3 & 4) - The Red Neon & LED channel letter light source test comparison. (28,000+ hrs)
      RedL071514.pdf



      Border Security (Year 3 & 4)- The Neon & LED border tube lamp test comparison. (18,000+ hrs)
      BorderSec 071514.pdf



      Blue Light Special Year 1 & 2) - The blue Neon & LED test comparison for channel letter. (7,000+ hrs)
      BlueLight071514.pdf


      The Great White Hope - Discontinued (Year 5) - The high powered white Neon & LED test comparison for large channel letters and sign cabinets, comprised of high powered LED modules 1watt+ and above with Tri-Phosphor Neon Lamps. (33,000+ hrs)
      Though discontinued, we'll still go ahead and make this available for reference
      Download LINK
    • By Erik Sine
      March 2014 Electric Sign Industry Neon & LED Test Comparison Results



      Below are the various categories of our test results made available for the electric sign industry. You can download the newest Sign Syndicate test comparison .pdf result sheet at the bottom of every Light Project Test entry with the most current date.

      Please remember....we have now made these light testing results available to you for free. If you feel like you have learned/gained something from these results or found that these results have saved you money by choosing one product over another please help support us in upgrading your free membership, or by purchasing various sign supplies we have available for you & your company. Many of our sign supply products are usually well below what you might pay for at one of the mainstream sign suppliers and some are bundles with free shipping. We've attached many various banners to the results in hope something may grab your eye.

      The Sign Syndicate does not engage in light source lamp sales such as LED's or Lamps so that we do not become a biased source for news & information and maintain that high standard of only dealing with the facts.

      For individual test result updates & information visit the Project Tutorials located here LINK

      As always, enjoy the results and hope you learn as we do going down this adventurous path!



      The Great White Hope II (Year 1) - The high powered white Neon & LED test comparison for large channel letters and sign cabinets, comprised of high powered LED modules 1watt+ and above with Tri-Phosphor Neon Lamps. (656 hrs)
      The start of our second month. Neon takes part of the usual normal initial 1000 hour lumen maintenance.
      GreatWhiteHopeII 031514.pdf
      Project Tight Whitey (Year 3 & 4) - The white exclusive LED only test comparison for mid (.85 watt modules and below) to mini sized LED modules. (32,000+ hrs)
      This month we introduce AA LED's Eco White used in large sign programs, MaxBrite LED, and SS Lights new improved LED
      ProJectTight 031514.pdf
      The Red Light District (Year 3 & 4) - The Red Neon & LED channel letter light source test comparison. (26,000+ hrs)
      This month we drop EGL's Red and add JS LED's new lineup
      RedL031514.pdf


      Border Security (Year 3 & 4)- The Neon & LED border tube lamp test comparison. (16,000+ hrs)
      Updated soon with Glostertube
      BorderSec 031514.pdf


      Blue Light Special Year 1 & 2) - The blue Neon & LED test comparison for channel letter. (5,000+ hrs)
      Updated Soon with FMS Neon & Glostertube
      BlueLight031514.pdf
    • By Erik Sine
      Here's an early pic of the first phase of our High Powered Neon / LED light test....The Great White Hope reborn!
      More White Neon this time around, we're starting off with 8 lamps comprised from FMS Neon, EGL, & Glostertube from Italy.
      The LEDs we're starting off with which are 1 watt modules and above are International Light, EGL, Permlight (Twisters & El PLato HO), GE (Tetra Power Max), Sloan (GW4), and Hyrite LED.
      More to come.




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