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A question on sign permits inside malls


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We all know that just about every outdoor sign requires a permit of some sort. Permits are the bane of my existance some weeks (months, decades) but I manage. My question is about permits inside malls. In my area, most municipalities (but not all) require a building permit with the occasional township wanting a zoning permit as well. I cover most of NJ, eastern PA plus the northern half of DE. What about the rest of the country and Canada? I'm not so concerned about the details or difficulty, just if needing a permit inside a mall is more common than not. I'm asking because recently a few account execs have acted surprised that permits inside a mall would be required. One just didn't believe me and wanted to 'check with the mall' even after I gave her the name/phone number of the local construction officer.

Whats it like in your neck of the woods? Are permits required inside malls or not?

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In my area (San Diego) a sign permit is not needed outdoors if the sign itself is not facing the "Public Right of Way" or street/road/freeway, same for a indoor outdoor shopping center, BUT you are required to pull a electrical permit which is less than a sign permit.

You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill

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Same here - interior signs only require electrical permits, not city/county permits. There are some restrictions on window neon signs in certain areas.....

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Rocco,

We at Sign Innovation have manufactured and Installed signage at malls in every state and Canada. It's in the thousands of locations. Every location is different depending on the local jurisdictions. We keep a spread sheet on every location. Its not uncommon to ask the mall personnel for advise, there the first people to ask. Then check with the local officials. and finally check with the stores general contractor. compare all of there answers because once you may think that you have all the permit bases covered, something can still pop up and hold up a store opening. I guess you need to be aware that there are many different angles that permits and inspections can come at you. As a sign guy (" the last one in" ) it always seems to be your fault when electrical isn't pulled, but the general was to have it covered or its your responsibility to call in the final on the generals permit. Always make shore there's a building permit pulled because if a sign permit or electrical or just a inspection is needed, they need to a-sign a location and paper trail for your permits.

Rocco, working in the northeast I know got most of this figured out Its a lot tougher there than most places, watch out for Florida, Chicago ,California. some Ohio areas

Tks ED

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Rocco,

We at Sign Innovation have manufactured and Installed signage at malls in every state and Canada. It's in the thousands of locations. Every location is different depending on the local jurisdictions. We keep a spread sheet on every location. Its not uncommon to ask the mall personnel for advise, there the first people to ask. Then check with the local officials. and finally check with the stores general contractor. compare all of there answers because once you may think that you have all the permit bases covered, something can still pop up and hold up a store opening. I guess you need to be aware that there are many different angles that permits and inspections can come at you. As a sign guy (" the last one in" ) it always seems to be your fault when electrical isn't pulled, but the general was to have it covered or its your responsibility to call in the final on the generals permit. Always make shore there's a building permit pulled because if a sign permit or electrical or just a inspection is needed, they need to a-sign a location and paper trail for your permits.

Rocco, working in the northeast I know got most of this figured out Its a lot tougher there than most places, watch out for Florida, Chicago ,California. some Ohio areas

Tks ED

Ed, I did your 'Body Central' install at Golden Triangle Mall in Denton. They're one that didn't require a permit. Good to see you here!

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At the indoor malls, no permit of any kind is required and the malls have not required me to add them on the insurance yet. They probably just haven't thought about it. New malls here are all outdoor set up to look like a faux village of some sort and the municipalities do require permits even though the signs are not facing a street which I find odd because I thought the whole premise of having a sign code was to make everything pretty while driving down the road.

Electrical varies. One 'burb requires an electrician sign off on the permit, another has a spot for me to sign saying a licensed electrician will make the final hookup, and the rest around town don't care as long as I have my bond.

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  • 2 weeks later...
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You folks are making me want to move someplace sane. I've been asking account execs as well as the responses here and it seems to just be a northeastern US thing - for now. At least I charge by the hour for permitting (with costs additional) so it's not all bad. It's getting so that on small jobs the permitting can be more expensive than the actual work.

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