signeye

Another set of boneheads with politcal power and here is what they are doing to us

Any Face material is going to knock down the brightness of any light source. What I did when I started to learn about LEDs was to learn more about the kelvin temp scale and extensive testing, thanks Westinghouse. We all kinda know it from buying 6500, 8300 or 4500 white when it came to glass but it was just a color. Now the game has changed. You need to understand how that color apears on the face of a sign. It may sound strange but I found alot of information in the photography industry. They are always concerned about light color even if it is off 100 degrees kelvin. The pigments in plastic resin will block out certin wavelenghts of color in the spectrum. Do some basic research on the color spectrum and then call your plastic suppliers, skip sign supply guys, and start asking questions about this topic. You may have to dig but you will find some interesting answers to your questions.

No high powered Green LEDs on the market at a reasonable price. Most greens and blues are in the low power family and the majority of channel letter work in the States is red or white.

Dave, There are very few options to single stroke with LED white product to get close to neon. What LED product was put into the job? The fact that you have double stroked your letters in the past is something the LED guy missed, no surprise. Who advised you on this? When I was dealing with customers in the past, it was important to know what had been in the cans before I sent a layout to the customer. Also, the fact that the light was going through green is another issue for white leds as they are blue in thier original state. They are then coated with phosphers to bring the K temp into the correct range. With that being said, the green and blue wave lenghts are being picked up by the vinyl and it makes this a very difficult application for SOME lower power LEDs to deal with. You need 1/2 watt or 1 watt LEDs to start with, probably double stroked and then you better get a layout from somebody who knows neon as well as the LEDs being concidered. Last, was it a 30mA or 60 mA tranny? Good luck.

I'll never be out...I have too many people calling me asking about the buisness but right now I am selling other products. There is no doubt it is not a high quality product. The platform speaks for itself. I think you and I are the only people here who know what to look for on a spec sheet or in the guts to really know what is up from down when it comes to white LEDs. I think this is mainland product, maybe aftermarket Korean. What the mainlanders dont want to realize is that labor is a huge issue in North America and Europe. Our countries are not markets where cheap products can be tossed out. Labor in Asia is dirt cheap, sometimes less than 10 cents an hour. Two guys on a bamboo truss can work all day and rip out miles of cheap product where here that just wont fly. It is no big deal for them to replace junk LEDs. This poor guy in Utah just doesnt get it but he will. If he has to deal with unions this will be replaced in 6 months for sure and Fishnut wins for sure, good for him. Then all the green people will walk away with thier faces RED!

Well put boss.

How did ya like the bin sort on the white...ranges from 7k to 16K Thats a combo A/B sort, unbelievable. Dem letters are all going to be blue after the summer heat cooks em up a little bit. I just dont see a way to for heat dissipation either. This is going to be a service mans dream account.

The kobe burger is 20 bucks but it's damn tasty!

Due to complications from my wifes surgery I will not be able to make it on Friday. I am trying to get there on Saturday but it all depends on her well being...have fun all

thingy dingy devise!

Yup...So Burger Bar at 5ish? :beerparty: then then whos in?

something or other

She then started

There is a mexican joint on the second level at the Luxor that may be an ideal spot to meet on Friday or the Burger bar in between the Luxor and Mandalay Bay is also a nice spot...? :beerparty: You have to walk right by the Burger bar on your way back from the convention center to both Luxor and Ex...they have killer burgers and the scenery is nice as well Also, any poker people up for a game? The Luxor will accomodate a private table if we can get 10 people...let me know and I will set it up.

Also Travis , I know for sure you have samples of my old product unless Jim has hijacked them...if he has, I still have some and will send them to you if you want.

Travis, I am long gone from that place but I will do what I can to keep my word and get you the results. It really is no secret and you can make your own evaluation by using a digital camera and adjusting the f stops for brightness. Longevity will take time as we have debated but it's right in your back yard, so I ask, how does it look? To address the point of the thread, I think there has been alot of great posts and I think that everybody needs to roll with the punches and accept alot of the BS that goes with the industry. WCSG, I love the site and I think you should bring about 5000 buisness cards to Vegas and hand them out or just drop them on the floor in all the neon and LED booths! That will help get the word out. Also, Having been born into the industry I think that the journeyman is really the lost factor here. My father was trained as a union journeyman and trained countless others...that just is not the case anymore. Unions had a place in this country a long time ago but that has passed. Until some form of training comes back into play this industry will be full of know it alls and helpers...no good. As I have posted in other threads, if you don't get involved at some level of associations everybody will continue to just screw the pooch. I guess I am just the kettel calling the pot black as for the third time in my sign carrer I have run away but I do applaud the people who stay for the punishment of having to deal with the people who come into the industry thinking it's a no brainer and can just sub out everything. :bitchin: My mom always said that any yahoo with a pickup and a ladder can call themself a sign person (very pc huh!) Damn shame we can't hold ourselves to a higher level. Don't give this up, this site will continue to grow...hang on brother.

To Whom this does concern; call 1-800 Whysign. It is the legal resource group retained by International Sign Association that you can use for legal counsel free of charge. Good luck

Google her and laugh! She really did her homework. WHAT A BONEHEAD! Considering the fact that there may only be 15 neon signs, LOL/JK, in the state she really made a statement. Hey Karen go after the the indoor tubes, if you can get that done then you deserve an award...What a freakin jackAZZ!

LD grade came out 4 years ago and cost 400ish for a 51x100, now it's in the 100's. Not much different than GP grade. This stuff will fall in price as well. I do wonder about the "small holes"? On the coasts for LED systems with bad coatings...no good, oxidation is going to crush you!

Born of hand lettering neon bender. I would like to think I see both sides of the fence well. My point is I have been around this industry a long time and I here alot of what should be done and I don't see people sticking it out at the association level to get the right things done. I am as guilty as most though so you can call me the kettel if ya like.

Ya, it's our fault...not. How many LED companies are even part of loacal and regional associations? Mine is. I havent seen you or your owner at our association meetings.