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Erik Sine

Big Huge Welcome

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Wanted to give a big warm welcome to LEDneon-Flex one of our newest Board Vendors.

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LEDneon-Flex is also participating in "Border Security", the Neon & LED border tube comparison and test. He's one of the Vendors on the board helping to make this current project possible

Though Border Security is very new and recently introduced this month, I have to say while putting the project together if you do a lot of LED neon tubing for project applications this product is very easy to fabricate & assemble, probably one of the easiest to use of all. I like to call it "Plug'n'PLay, it's really that easy, fast to butt together, fast to install using channels, flexible to curve and adjust.

We have them featured in the current testing in Blue, we have their green which we will be adding in as well.

Below are a few pics of the products we are using in our testing here on The Sign Syndicate.com

The two secondary wiring options

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Pics of their blue in our Border Security Test

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You can visit them at http://ledneonflex.com/ for more product information, or Contact Derek who is on the board as "LEDneonFlex" derek@ledneonflex.com


You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill

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welcome to the Syndicate.......and thank you for joining up! :fnd (1):


Kirstie Gastelum

Sign Supply Sales

P: (858) 880-1400  kirstie@electricsignsupply.com

Kgirl-Sign-Supply-Sig-1.jpg

 

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I work with Derek at LED Neon Flex and I think you are all going to be very surprised with how our product holds up against regular neon and how much easier and less expensive it is to install. Not to mention more energy efficient. Sometimes it is hard for us to convert the regular sign guys, the old-schoolers, because they don't believe LED can be as bright or they think it is too expensive.

When you factor in the cost of installation, we are right on par with regular neon, allowing the customer to see the cost savings almost immediately. We just did a major casino project in Iowa and they are reporting saving $5,000 a month on operation and maintenance costs.

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I work with Derek at LED Neon Flex and I think you are all going to be very surprised with how our product holds up against regular neon and how much easier and less expensive it is to install. Not to mention more energy efficient. Sometimes it is hard for us to convert the regular sign guys, the old-schoolers, because they don't believe LED can be as bright or they think it is too expensive.

When you factor in the cost of installation, we are right on par with regular neon, allowing the customer to see the cost savings almost immediately. We just did a major casino project in Iowa and they are reporting saving $5,000 a month on operation and maintenance costs.

Savings sometimes yes but $5,000 a month..... $60,000 a year? That one I would have to see proof to believe


Installation & Maintenance Services

Brian Phillips | expresssignandneon@sbcglobal.net | P. 812-882-3278

Express Sign & Neon | 119 S. 15th Street - Vincennes - IN 47591

express%20neon%20sig.jpg

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I work with Derek at LED Neon Flex and I think you are all going to be very surprised with how our product holds up against regular neon and how much easier and less expensive it is to install. Not to mention more energy efficient. Sometimes it is hard for us to convert the regular sign guys, the old-schoolers, because they don't believe LED can be as bright or they think it is too expensive.

When you factor in the cost of installation, we are right on par with regular neon, allowing the customer to see the cost savings almost immediately. We just did a major casino project in Iowa and they are reporting saving $5,000 a month on operation and maintenance costs.

Savings sometimes yes but $5,000 a month..... $60,000 a year? That one I would have to see proof to believe

looks like another case of a misplaced decimal point. ooops.

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Hello Sign Syndicate! Thank you for the warm welcome and positive feedback:)

Any questions or concerns around LED Neon Flex I'm here to help.

Respectfully,

Derek

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I work with Derek at LED Neon Flex and I think you are all going to be very surprised with how our product holds up against regular neon and how much easier and less expensive it is to install. Not to mention more energy efficient. Sometimes it is hard for us to convert the regular sign guys, the old-schoolers, because they don't believe LED can be as bright or they think it is too expensive.

When you factor in the cost of installation, we are right on par with regular neon, allowing the customer to see the cost savings almost immediately. We just did a major casino project in Iowa and they are reporting saving $5,000 a month on operation and maintenance costs.

3000 Linear Feet of LED Neon Flex Yellow X 1.8 Watts/Ft = 5400 Watt/Hours

3000 Linear Feet of Glass X 7 Watts/Ft = 21,000 Watt/Hours

The rest of the math would depend on utility cost.

This is using the 120V system that does not require power supplies, the rectifier bridge consumes about 8 Watts but will also push 125 linear feet.

I'm not exactly sure how the above numbers were produced, I think they were using incandescent lamps for cove lighting and not actual neon. I did not receive the feedback on actual savings.

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Welcome to the place to be LEDneon>>>>>>

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How bout not quoting savings and numbers if they can't be shown how the numbers were achieved. This is exactly what this site tries to promote - fair, truthful advertising and claims.

gn

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How bout not quoting savings and numbers if they can't be shown how the numbers were achieved. This is exactly what this site tries to promote - fair, truthful advertising and claims.

gn

Exactly! Always amuses me when you ask to see the numbers on just how someone achieved these huge savings they don't know how they came up with the results.


Installation & Maintenance Services

Brian Phillips | expresssignandneon@sbcglobal.net | P. 812-882-3278

Express Sign & Neon | 119 S. 15th Street - Vincennes - IN 47591

express%20neon%20sig.jpg

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How bout not quoting savings and numbers if they can't be shown how the numbers were achieved. This is exactly what this site tries to promote - fair, truthful advertising and claims.

gn

Exactly! Always amuses me when you ask to see the numbers on just how someone achieved these huge savings they don't know how they came up with the results.

That is why I demonstrated the power savings in watts instead of dollar value.

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How bout not quoting savings and numbers if they can't be shown how the numbers were achieved. This is exactly what this site tries to promote - fair, truthful advertising and claims.

gn

Exactly! Always amuses me when you ask to see the numbers on just how someone achieved these huge savings they don't know how they came up with the results.

That is why I demonstrated the power savings in watts instead of dollar value.

Sorry if I was not clear, I know it was not you who made the big saving claim


Installation & Maintenance Services

Brian Phillips | expresssignandneon@sbcglobal.net | P. 812-882-3278

Express Sign & Neon | 119 S. 15th Street - Vincennes - IN 47591

express%20neon%20sig.jpg

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How bout not quoting savings and numbers if they can't be shown how the numbers were achieved. This is exactly what this site tries to promote - fair, truthful advertising and claims.

gn

Exactly! Always amuses me when you ask to see the numbers on just how someone achieved these huge savings they don't know how they came up with the results.

That is why I demonstrated the power savings in watts instead of dollar value.

Sorry if I was not clear, I know it was not you who made the big saving claim

I understand, just trying to keep the information I provide clear and concise. rgds.

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I was actually quoting the number provided by the client. Derek gave the wattage savings, which were substantial but I also think the other savings the client quoted related to maintenance which is difficult to quantify. The client stated that the previous lighting that was in place required quite a bit of maintenance and repair, so the $5,000 a month number I think included all of that.

It was not my intention to spout off a big number for effect, I was merely reciting a number that was given to me by a casino client that had a very large install. I apologize for not calling him a liar and demanding to see the breakdown.

Edited by mburton000

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I was actually quoting the number provided by the client. Derek gave the wattage savings, which were substantial but I also think the other savings the client quoted related to maintenance which is difficult to quantify. The client stated that the previous lighting that was in place required quite a bit of maintenance and repair, so the $5,000 a month number I think included all of that.

It was not my intention to spout off a big number for effect, I was merely reciting a number that was given to me by a casino client that had a very large install. I apologize for not calling him a liar and demanding to see the breakdown.

So you actually think they spent most of $60,000.00 per year on maintenance? Oh come on. As far as calling them a liar that is crazy, but if you state some huge numbers on here, be prepared to be questioned and have some facts to back it up. These guys and gals are not stupid and will catch it every time.


Installation & Maintenance Services

Brian Phillips | expresssignandneon@sbcglobal.net | P. 812-882-3278

Express Sign & Neon | 119 S. 15th Street - Vincennes - IN 47591

express%20neon%20sig.jpg

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Actually, he said operation, & Maintenance. So, $5k may not be that far off. If it's a casino, most likely the lights run 24/7, if so the the cost saving from Neon to the LED lamps would be around $17k a year to $1,400 or so a month, even larger savings when it comes to incandescent lamps, which would be much higher than Neon, probably more than double that number making it $3k a month. Throw in 3-4 service calls a month if it's an old casino, labor time, difficulty of access and materials. $5k might be slightly higher, but the above mentioned might be pretty damn well close to $4k, some times higher sometimes lower.

I've never maintained a casino, but was just in Vegas, I saw a lot of nightmare installations and outages while strolling through Freemont Street. I don't know that I would want to be a serviceman there.


You have enemies? Good. That means you've stood up for something, sometime in your life. - Winston Churchill

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I was actually quoting the number provided by the client. Derek gave the wattage savings, which were substantial but I also think the other savings the client quoted related to maintenance which is difficult to quantify. The client stated that the previous lighting that was in place required quite a bit of maintenance and repair, so the $5,000 a month number I think included all of that.

It was not my intention to spout off a big number for effect, I was merely reciting a number that was given to me by a casino client that had a very large install. I apologize for not calling him a liar and demanding to see the breakdown.

So you actually think they spent most of $60,000.00 per year on maintenance? Oh come on. As far as calling them a liar that is crazy, but if you state some huge numbers on here, be prepared to be questioned and have some facts to back it up. These guys and gals are not stupid and will catch it every time.

I'll follow up with the client and see if I can get a breakdown from him. If I had to guess, I'd say they were spending $1,000 a month on maintenance on average and the rest of the savings were operational. When I say maintenance I mean costs related to replacement and repair. That seems reasonable when you are talking about the linear footage they replaced and do the math on an average 70-75% less wattage used. I'd have to get the KwH rate for their area to do an accurate breakdown though.

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I was actually quoting the number provided by the client. Derek gave the wattage savings, which were substantial but I also think the other savings the client quoted related to maintenance which is difficult to quantify. The client stated that the previous lighting that was in place required quite a bit of maintenance and repair, so the $5,000 a month number I think included all of that.

It was not my intention to spout off a big number for effect, I was merely reciting a number that was given to me by a casino client that had a very large install. I apologize for not calling him a liar and demanding to see the breakdown.

Welcome to the board. Your buddy hit a rough note when he insinuated that us old timers, neon guys, stoic ancient sign men, aren't quite up to retreating when led folks speak a few "untruths". If there were tons of bulbs, and you were changing to leds - you probably made your customer a happy camper - bulbs don't last a long time. If you replaced neon, which I doubt, your leds would PALE in comparison to neon tubing. No doubt, low voltage, no doubt no breakage, no doubt any idiot can install neon rather than "expenseive craftsmen" as your web page states must be used for neon. What you fail to mention on your website is that neon is 100 per cent recyclable - unlike leds. Neon can always be repaired/replaced unlike leds. For a long time, signs were a craft - now they are a commodity sold at the cheapest price, guaranteed to last until you fall asleep. Your blue, per your website is a whopping 37.5 l/f and EGL horizon blue is 170 l/f. Not a fair comparison I would say. While led rope has its place, like all leds - there are many times that in signs it would be far easier to just use neon and avoid all the headaches - while your led product MIGHT be available for a couple years - neon was, is, and will still available, colors still match, transformers still work, and the neon will be still be burning bright long, long after led products have failed.

And please tell your cohort - speak kindly of us old timers till he gets the chance to meet us. then he might not speak kindly of us (me) at all.

Welcome to the board though - it'll be interesting in the border security how the products fair against each other.

gn

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I was actually quoting the number provided by the client. Derek gave the wattage savings, which were substantial but I also think the other savings the client quoted related to maintenance which is difficult to quantify. The client stated that the previous lighting that was in place required quite a bit of maintenance and repair, so the $5,000 a month number I think included all of that.

It was not my intention to spout off a big number for effect, I was merely reciting a number that was given to me by a casino client that had a very large install. I apologize for not calling him a liar and demanding to see the breakdown.

Welcome to the board. Your buddy hit a rough note when he insinuated that us old timers, neon guys, stoic ancient sign men, aren't quite up to retreating when led folks speak a few "untruths". If there were tons of bulbs, and you were changing to leds - you probably made your customer a happy camper - bulbs don't last a long time. If you replaced neon, which I doubt, your leds would PALE in comparison to neon tubing. No doubt, low voltage, no doubt no breakage, no doubt any idiot can install neon rather than "expenseive craftsmen" as your web page states must be used for neon. What you fail to mention on your website is that neon is 100 per cent recyclable - unlike leds. Neon can always be repaired/replaced unlike leds. For a long time, signs were a craft - now they are a

commodity sold at the cheapest price, guaranteed to last until you fall asleep. Your blue, per your website is a whopping 37.5 l/f and EGL horizon blue is 170 l/f. Not a fair comparison I would say. While led rope has its place, like all leds - there are many times that in

signs it would be far easier to just use neon and avoid all the headaches - while your led product MIGHT be available for a couple years

- neon was, is, and will still available, colors still match, transformers still work, and the neon will be still be burning bright long, long after led products

And please tell your cohort - speak kindly of us old timers till he gets the chance to meet us. then he might not speak kindly of us (me) at all.

Welcome to the board though - it'll be interesting in the border security how the products fair against each other.

gn

"gauranteed to last until you fall asleep". LMAO

Craft is definitely missing from the sign trade

I think many of the quality sign craftsman have either retired or been replaced by a trained monkey

Edited by saneon

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