Whats the diff?

[rocketdesigns]

This may be a lame-ass question, but here it is anyway....

Thumbing through the local sign supplier catalog, I noticed a section advertising LED strip lighting for channel letters. If this method of lighting is, as they put it, equivalent to neon in brightness, low voltage, and less energy and maintanence costs, then why is neon still being used? I'm sure there is something that neon does better, I just plead ignorance, yet again! Seriously though, I'm intersted to know the pros and cons in my continuing quest for knowledge. Thanks for any replies, and apologies if my questions are annoying! :blah1:

Guido

Edited February 1, 2007 by rocketdesigns

[Erik Sine]

Hmmmm let me see, a quick way to sum it up in MY opinion and MY reasons.

LED's have their place on the market but when it comes to a channel letter sign taller than 6-8" i'm going with neon because:

1) neon is brighter by far

2) the LED market changes so fast replacement will probably not match when it comes time to service for modules, and other components, LED color (this can also be the same for neon)

3) Neon transformers can be more effecient than LED power supplies

3.5) in order to get LED's anywhere near a standard #6500 white your cost of the sign, and power consumption cost will exceed the reason

Reasons I would use LED's for channel letters

1) if installation required it, by call out or ease of installation

2) lighting

Remember this is channel letter specific. There are reasons and applications to use them other than in channel letter lighting

But, down the road this all will change for backlighting. It's more a question of when. Will LED's phase out or replace neon completely, no.

[imanut]

That was a pretty darn good summary-------------and I might add, do NOT believe everything, nor much of, what is written by LED companies aboaut LED's. Neon has been out, proven, virtually as long as Adam first poked Eve. LED people, and their materials, are full of bias, bullshit, and propaganda. And when they have to "put up or shut up"---------they run for the door. Does LED have a use------------obviously, yes. Does it have a place in our society, and our little commerce of making and building signs, yes. Will it eliminate neon, no. Make a dent in the neon industry because of the bullshit, bias, and propaganda, yes. Would I install a LED sign over a good neon sign-------------assuming I got to do the neon and the install-------------???? Heavens, no.

I watched a customer of my Dad's, who had neon that my dad had made, by their calculations some 25-28 years prior. Being the consumate professional that he was------------cut the electrodes off, cleaned out the tube, used the same electrodes, repumped the tube-----------------and both he and the client laughed about whether it would last another 25-28 years before some person broke it.

gn

[joemomma]

Here's one of the diffs. Below is a quote from a thread I started in Electric Signs. (If you want to read the whole thread, it's titled "My first led channel letter sign", or something like that, and right now it's on pg. 3.)

"It was a small sign, maybe 18"x 60", filled with white led's. I didn't count them, but I'll bet there were several hundred cute little led's in that sign. It pulled 5 amps!! And it was DIM. I did some figuring before I left and calculated that the sign could've been filled with CL71 and a 9/30. It would've been 2x as bright and pulled under 2.5 amps. And it probably would've been 1/2 the price."

Here's another diff. How many colors does the led industry offer? How many colors does the neon industry offer? Some of the led colors - red, green, blue, white, they may have an orange by now, and there may be a few others I'm not aware of. Some of the neon colors - clear red, ruby red, coral, and about 30 or more other reds, green, veep green, emerald green, and several other greens, powder blue, rich blue, cobalt blue, and several other blues, turquoise and super turq, pink and hot pink, peach, black light (that's right - black light - 2 kinds), purple and classic purple, lavender, several yellows and golds. I know that I've missed some. Don't even get me started on the whites.

Here's another diff. When was the last time you read that some in the neon industry were trying to legislate led's out of existence? Why can't the led industry, even with some of them grossly exaggerating led's average life, energy efficiency, and brightness, let the marketplace be the judge of their product?

Here's another diff. Look at my avatar (go to the gallery for a bigger pic) and envision it with led's in place of neon.

[imanut]

Here's another diff. Look at my avatar and envision it with led's in place of neon.

Geez---think how boring mine would be if it said LED LED LED

gn

Edited February 2, 2007 by Westcoast Sign Guy

[joemomma]

Here's another diff. Look at my avatar and envision it with led's in place of neon.

Geez---think how boring mine would be if it said LED LED LED

gn

LMAO. Reminds me of MONA. Can you imagine MOLEDA?

[rocketdesigns]

Right on, fellas! I get the point, for sure. Its all clear now. All very good reasons, at least from an outside perspective. Sucks, there's always someone gunning to phase out the good stuff. Happened with 2-stroke engines, as well.

Seems like there is much more of an art to neon.

[imanut]

Right on, fellas! I get the point, for sure. Its all clear now. All very good reasons, at least from an outside perspective. Sucks, there's always someone gunning to phase out the good stuff. Happened with 2-stroke engines, as well.

Seems like there is much more of an art to neon.

Absolutely-----------------------and the difference between a good neon man and a neon arteeeeest--------------an arteeeeest can't follow a pattern to save his soul. The explanation for not being able to -------he'[s expressing his creative abilities. While the good neon man------------he can follow a pattern to the line, and he's still able to express his creative abilities by proving it.

gn

[John L]

-he can follow a pattern to the line, and he's still able to express his creative abilities by proving it.

Well said.

The top paid employee here is our neon guy. I own the company and he is doing better than me most times... I wear all other hats but I dont bend.